Hello my friends...
Here are some iquestions to get us started, thinking, discussing, etc. Of course anyone else that has questions please do post but here are some questions on Part One to Part Two which is through chapter 19. I feel like a freakin' English teacher!
1.) Why does Ariel need the book so much? Is it strictly accademic or does she have some other reason for it?
2.) Where is Professor Burlem? Is he alive or a figmanet of Ariel's immagination?
3.) How do you relate to Ariel's sense of lonlieness at her age? Is it something you can understand and is it articulated well in the text?
4.) What do you make of Patrick? Is he good for Ariel or just trouble?
5.) In chater 12 Ariel is told she has a choice as she drinks the mixture that Mr Y made. What does this mean?
6.) What did you think was going to happen? (I personally thought she was going to end up dead even though it was only a few hundred pages into the book.)
7.) What the heck is with that number thing in Chapter 12? I really didn't get it.
8.) Does the first part of the book link science and literature with ease or is there a tension between these two elements?
9.) Is the Trophesphere(sp) a state of being or a physical entity in your opinion?
10.) Does Apollo Smitheus represent something to Ariel, perhaps a father-figure she is lacking?
Right so there are some questions. If you want to start a thread on the questions let me know. I will try to finish the discussion later this weekend or tonight if all goes well.
*Kate
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After Kate’s warning about the book being a little ‘rude’, I was nervous to open it. What were we getting into? But overall I haven’t found it any worse than some of the movies I have seen. Other than a few short graphic scenes, it really does more alluding to sex I think. Anyway, from the beginning when she laid out of the hook of a mysterious book being found in a tiny used book shop, I was hooked! I am interested in how she presents the story line tied into so many quotes and philosophical ideas. Reminds me of late nights at Old Chicago’s with Craig discussing life! ;) Here are my thoughts on Kate’s questions:
ReplyDelete1.) I think she is definitely searching for something to hold onto in her life. She seems very unstable and perhaps by finding the book she can move her life into a different direction. Maybe she feels it will bring her some answers to the many questions she seems to be asking about the meaning of life, the functioning of life, etc. Conversely though, perhaps she is just interested in knowing about it. Something surrounded in so much mystery (and death) is always intriguing.
2.) I feel like he is dead or at least somewhere far away since he hasn’t been around his office for over a year. If he were a figment of her imagination then the bit where she has to get her colleague to help her get a file of his computer wouldn’t make sense…
3.) I feel like she is just filling her empty hole (ha! Gross. I didn’t mean it like that) with sex, to not such great results. But I am also not sure that she is newly lonely, since there are references to the absence of her family, her cutting, etc. I don’t feel that I can relate directly to her loneliness (praise God!) but it is laid out pretty vividly by the lack of people she interacts with, what she does in her free time, and how she lives.
I do wish there would have been a bit more precise character development to begin with. I want to know more about Ariel from the start of her life so I can answer more of the ‘Why is she like this now?’…but I guess the novel is about what she is doing rather than who she is.
Also, semi-related, the quote (in my book pg. 45), “They taught me that everything you are told by anyone is a lie. But then it turned out that they lied too.” Aside from being an amusing paradox, I couldn’t help wondering what kind of person would this kind of upbringing create? How does this mindset influence Ariel’s adult life?
I have been worrying lately about how much impact parents’ decisions and lessons have on a person’s life. This scares me more than I can say, as I mull over becoming a parent. I am so afraid of making too many mistakes (I am not naïve enough to think I won’t make at least one) and having my child not be stable. Have you guys ever read “We Need to Talk About Kevin”? Anyway, I am way off track sorry…
4.) Patrick is first and foremost a cheating bastard. I don’t think being involved in extramarital relationships is ever good for anyone.
5.) I like this element of the novel (the console always saying ‘you have no choices’ or ‘you have 10 choices’, etc.) because I often reflect on my own life on how many choices I have. It is often overwhelming to try to decide what path to take since what we choose everyday has determined who we became, and who we will be. I think that Ariel’s choice in the broader sense here is that she could choose to enter the Troposphere or not.
6.) Me too. Since that is what was alluded to (“Everyone connected to this book dies.” “There is a curse on this book.”).
Also, at this point in the novel, and still as I read through it, I can’t stop thinking “What would I do?” Would I make the potion and drink it? If I could enter a Troposphere, would I actually want to enter other people’s minds and know what they were thinking?!? I am thinking, no way buster! But I also know that if I had the knowledge to make something like that possible my curiosity would nag at me to just try it and see. We are seeing what this curiosity is doing to Ariel’s life (how the Troposphere is apparently addictive). What would you girls do?
7.) That page reminded me of the falling numbers in The Matrix! I guess it is just Thomas’ way of conveying to readers the feeling of being surrounded by falling numbers. If you stare at the page for a little bit, the numbers go all funny and wavy. I thought for a second there is probably a pattern there but I couldn’t be bothered to sit long enough to actually find out. A page of only numbers is kinda fun and suits the general uniqueness of this novel but maybe a waste of paper at the same time?
8.) I think Thomas is trying to convey a general tension between schools of thought. Hard fact versus fuzzy thoughts/feelings. We all experienced this contrast in our university classes (I had lots of profs talk down the ‘fuzzy studies’ and others wrinkle their noses at the thought of a laboratory). I am always amused by people’s need to separate themselves into groups/sides (perhaps a consequence of my life in Japan?). The two genres often seem to push against each other rather than work together. I really liked the dinner party conversation between Ariel, Adam and Heather. This chapter really presented the ‘tension’ well I think. I also am enjoying how many quotes the author includes from so many different sources (philosophers, physicists, etc.). I think at some point all academic subjects deal with similar issues.
9.) I think it is a state of being or a state of mind? I feel like it is like a big fuzzy cloud floating somewhere around/above? the characters. I don’t think it is a place per se, but rather some sort of trance or meditative state that is entered (and therefore imagined?). I think maybe it looks different for each character too, based on some of Apollo Smitheus’ comments.
10.) I felt like he is a way for her to rescue herself from things she wasn’t understanding about the state she entered. She needed help, he appeared. Perhaps he doesn’t exist at all but is some part of her consciousness explaining the finer parts of the Troposphere to her? All I know is that this book is a little silly and wacky and I kind of like it. Something different from what I have been reading recently!
That’s all for now. I am anxious to keep reading.
Okay! Sorry it’s taken so long to get to this. I want to preface your questions, Kate with saying that while this book is a bit over my head with all the philosophical details and science jibber-jabber, I am totally loving it! More on that to come : ) Oh! And another disclaimer: I’m about 50 pages from the end of the book right now, but am going to try to write like I’ve only read the first half.
ReplyDelete1. I hardly think the search is academic. While she may be able to use the book for her studies, I think it’s just one of those things for which we want so badly and the search just becomes a part of our lives. Kind of like searching for a pot of gold or a unicorn.
2. I agree with Katy, in that he’s not a figment of Ariel’s imagination. I haven’t felt since starting the book that the curse is death. Yes, people have dies, BUT why did they die? I think the curse is NEEDING to get back into the Troposhere. So no, I don’t think he’s dead, yet.
3. I also agree with Katy that I think her loneliness stems from way before we started the book, probably even into her early childhood. And while we can be external viewers and are able to tell that she is lonely (and miserable?), I’m not quite sure she sees it.
4. Patrick is scum. Yes. Generally acknowledged fact. BUT… What does that make Ariel? We like her because she is our heroine of the book, but is she really that much different then Patrick? What would Patrick’s story be like? Would we like him if we were in his mind?
Oh! Oh! Oh! I just had an insight!!!!!!! I have really enjoyed Scarlett Thomas’ writing style, but the whole first person, present tense did take quite a while to get used to. BUT!!!!! Think about it. We are in Ariel’s head, as she is doing all of this. In a sense, we are in the Troposphere. While we are experiencing everything with her, and feeling what she is feeling, we are still piggybacking her experience! So brilliant! Makes me like the book even more!
Okay… Back to questions!
5. Yeah, I also think it’s a choice to remain in unknowing or to take the leap. Almost like a warning… That she of course doesn’t heed.
6. I didn’t think she was going do die. I didn’t know what to expect, but I knew that the story was finally getting somewhere. I had a hard time getting into the book. I knew I liked the book, and I was really interested to see where it would go, but the whole philosophy and science combination is quite a bit over my head and I had a hard time with it. I just wanted to get to the adventure part of the novel.
7. Ummm… I ignored it. Although looking back, it does make a little more sense.
8. In all honesty, I don’t know how to answer this. I like the idea of the two being merged and seeing what could come of it, but I don’t understand how it would work. I also think the dinner party was a great example of all this and how there are people out there (Ariel, and possibly Adam) who could make it work. But if I were at that dinner party, I would have been even more confused than Heather. Yes, I am more open to thought than Heather is, but my brain just doesn’t turn on analytically like that.
9. State of being, but so strong of one that it can dramatically alter the physical world.
10. I sort of think Apollo Smintheus is like Ariel’s safety blanket within the Troposhere. She weakly calls on him whenever she finds herself in a conundrum or in danger. Perhaps he could be called friend: she wonders about him in the real world as if her were a friend. But I really think he’s more of just her helper and guide.
Okay, that’s all for now folks. I have tons more thoughts and questions, but I am going to wait until I finish the book!
LOVE YOU!!!!
Girls, just a quick note to say that I have read the book (I actually had finished it by the first week of February) and I just saw that the questions were up a few days ago, but I can't comment this weekend because my sister will be here so will try to do so next week. By no means take this as a sign that I don't want to do the book club anymore... I just won't be home!
ReplyDeleteLove you all xoxo Meagan
Hey girls-
ReplyDeleteSorry for my tardiness. I am also about 50 pages from the end of the book, and just haven't had the time to post!! I think the rest of you are done with it by now, though...
1.
oh shoot. I thought I had 30 minutes to write, but Finley decided not to go to sleep after all... grr. This has happened so many times! 2 brand new teeth + a nasty cold + going on vacation does not equal good naps!
I'll hopefully be back later.
Karissa
Ok - take 2.
ReplyDeleteFirst I should probably say that I have a love/hate relationship with this book. One moment I am totally bored, or rolling my eyes, and the next I am devouring each word, and I can't wait to find out what happens! The book took too long to actually get off the ground, in my opinion - the action didn't really start for quite some time, nor did I feel particularly attached to/interested in the characters. And did anyone else notice that we did't learn Ariel's name until several chapters in? (I think... don't have time to go back and look, but I remember thinking that we didn't even know her name, or her sex, for a while - unless you've read the back cover).
Also, I find myself tending to zone out during some of the more 'in depth' discussions the characters have. Maybe I'm just not interested in the "intellectual jibber-jabber" (I like your phrase, Gretch!)? Actually, I think it's more likely that my brain is so fried in the evenings when I do have time to read, that I just can't process it all. So I get a little bored with those parts, and the super-descriptive passages about the troposphere. That said, I really do think that Thomas writes well. Although I feel like she uses too many adjectives, it somehow works.
Also, the fact that the book is so sex-centric is kind of annoying to me. A sex-crazed mouse? Come on. Silly. Just a sign that sex sells in our society (and probably in all societies), I guess.
Anyway, on to the questions.
#1. I think she's searching for the book because she really doesn't have much of value in her life. Few friends - no family - no real home. All she has is her magazine job and her PhD research, neither of which she is finding fulfilling. She's a very pitiful sort of character. Thomas did a good job of painting a real person.
#2. From the very beginning, I felt certain that Professor Burlem would reappear, and would be an integral part of the story. There are so many references to him, that I felt sure Thomas would continue to develop that plot line.
#3. Her loneliness is so extreme that I have a hard time relating to it.
#4. Patrick: Gross. And really sad. If we knew more about him, I'm sure we'd learn that he has some deep-seated pain and problems that he's never dealt with.
#5. I agree with Katy regarding the "console" - I really like that part of the book! It's a really interesting concept.
#6. The anticipation as Ariel drinks the mixture was great - this was one of the moments that I couldn't wait to read on! However, I thought the whole mouse plot line was pretty lame. Her other experiences in the troposphere are much more interesting!
#7. I think that Thomas didn't know how else to convey what she wanted to exactly - hence the numbers. It didn't really work for me. But maybe it does for some people?
#8. Um... again, this comes from a sleep-deprived mommy brain... but the shifting between the two has seemed choppy to me. And sometimes it furthers the story, but sometimes I have felt like it doesn't. I have really enjoyed reading about Ariel's "thought experiments", though. I am completely unfamiliar with that whole concept. And I am becoming increasingly curious about "Schroedinger's Cat". I kind of want to research it!
#9. Probably a state of being. It kind of reminds me of the spiritual realm that we all are affected by, but that few people can see. Kind of like the Frank Peretti books, for those of you who have read them. Maybe the troposphere is similar in that it affects everyone in the world (with the gods, etc.), but most people ignore it or don't even know it exists.
#10. I think I agree with Gretchen. He seems to be some sort of guide for her within the troposphere. But a weird one! The whole concept of everything (and everyone) looking different to each person when the enter the troposphere is really creative and bizarre! I like it!
Again, I'm sorry it took me so long to post here. It's not fair to people (Katy) who are so on top of things!!
I am almost done with the book, so I'll be back soon!
Love you all!
kjoy